Characterization of Enemy Leaders

[CATION]

Alternatively titled: The other leaders are buttheads.

Why the distinction between Firestar, the “good” leader, and the others? I haven’t picked up any book in “The Fourth Apprentice” arc, so my opinion might be a little outdated, but it’s a trend that I’m sure everyone has noticed. I understand that these books are geared toward younger readers who might need the more distinct line between “good” and “bad”, but, come on, kids aren’t that thick. It has always bugged me that the Warriors worlds was always pretty much divided with ThunderClan on one side and everyone else kind of lumped together on the other.


We had:

Brokenstar: The first villain of the series, Brokenstar was basically there because we all needed an enemy for Firepaw to fight. Obviously, Tigerclaw was an ominous bat waiting in the wings, but we couldn’t call him out on his crimes. Not to mention, we couldn’t have the main enemy be someone from ThunderClan just yet, we haven’t gotten to see how noble all ThunderClan cats are. Brokenstar, on the other hand, was a liar and a murderer, not to mention his deputy killed Spottedleaf, and he was in ShadowClan, which is the most ominous-sounding of the Clans. There you go, a perfect recipe for a leader!villain. Firepaw joins the attack at the end of the book, drives out all the corruption with all the other T-Clan heroes, and, bingo, warrior ceremony.

Nightstar: Does this guy even count? The poor dear, Erin pretty much killed him off (and his deputy, conveniently) to make way for Tigerclaw’s rise to power in ShadowClan. Anyways, just as a recap, Nightpelt was the ShadowClan elder during Brokenstar’s regime who takes over after his evil predecessor is cast out. He started out decently enough, thanking Firepaw & Co. for their help with Brokenstar. But then he becomes leader and bam! Insta-jerk. He has the gall to disagree with Bluestar’s infinite wisdom in bringing WindClan back to the forest, argues with Crookedstar over the river, unites with RiverClan to drive WindClan back out of the territories, and then attacks ThunderClan (with the aid of WindClan, I guess old hostilities die fast) when it is discovered that they are sheltering Brokenstar/tail. And then, in spite of all the trouble he’s caused, he gets some lame-o death by sickness and we find out that he was cheated out of his nine lives (of course, this might by the reason why he was so angry when he found out that Brokenstar was living with ThunderClan, since he couldn’t get his nine lives because Brokenstar was still recognized as the ShadowClan leader…someone should write a fanfiction).

Tigerstar: I could go into a recap of all the stuff that went down with this enemy-who-took-fifty-books-to-die, but I think we’re familiar.

Blackstar: Blackstar, as Blackfoot, already has his moment of jerk-ery when he kills a ThunderClan elder in the first book. He is last seen in that book being chased out of ShadowClan with Brokenstar and the other rogues. As an outlaw, he causes all sorts of mayhem for ThunderClan, proceeds to join Tigerclaw when he is exiled, and then becomes the ShadowClan deputy when Tigerstar becomes leader. First of all, BRILLIANT, ERINS, JUST PURE BRILLIANT. The same Clan that was ready to kick some serious butt when they found out that Brokenstar was with ThunderClan is now accepting one of Brokenstar’s chief co-conspirators, not to mention a handful of his other allies? Yeah, yeah, makes perfect sense. Anyways, he is then elected to be the ShadowClan leader, and proceeds to be the typical “I am leader of ShadowClan, therefore I must be a confrontational jerk who listens not to common sense”. When all the destruction is going on in the forest, he refuses help, keeps apart from the other Clans at Sunningrocks (even sets up a guard), and even wants his Clan to travel on their own to a new home. Once settled in the forest, he instigates squabbles over ThunderClan territory, and when Sol comes along, he declares the ShadowClan will not follow StarClan any longer. And, of course, he does his usually sneering about how foolish and weak ThunderClan cats are.

Crookedstar: Now this one ain’t so bad. He has his moments, what with him being against WindClan returning and uniting with ShadowClan against WindClan in Fire and Ice, but, for the most part, he’s probably one of the fairest leaders out there that isn’t in ThunderClan.

Leopardstar: Now, Crookedstar’s successor is another story all together. She has a permanent chip on her shoulder towards ThunderClan due to the accidental death of Whiteclaw, and almost kills Fireheart during the battle in Fire and Ice. She doesn’t like to cooperate with the other Clans, even as the deputy. As leader, one of her first acts is to launch a bold attack for possession of Sunningrocks, which ends in a sound defeat for RiverClan, and, to top it all off, joins up with Tigerstar to form TigerClan by the end of the arc, prepared even to fight against ThunderClan and WindClan. During the journey to the lake, she remains snarky as ever, and even causes tensions once the new territories are established when she demands more territory. She is even convinced by Hawkfrost to exile Stormfur and Brook – not exactly an exemplary Clan leader. Not much of RiverClan is really seen in the next few books, but RiverClan and WindClan do attack ThunderClan in Eclipse.

Tallstar: Like Crookedstar, here’s another leader that escapes the role of “enemy leaders are jerks”. He gangs up on ThunderClan with ShadowClan to kill Brokenstar, but this is understandable, as WindClan were actually forced out of their home by the former leader. In fact, throughout most of the books, Tallstar and his Clan are like the perpetual allies to ThunderClan, with one usually coming to the aid of the other during bleak times. Things only get tense in a couple of cases, and they seem to get over it quickly enough.

Onestar: Another insta-jerk leader, Onewhisker was always a friend of Fireheart, ever since the ThunderClan warrior brought WindClan home. However, at the lake territories where he becomes leader, he becomes aloof and confrontational with Firestar, spurning his offers of assistance. At the next Gathering, he sits above the other leaders and criticizes the other Clans for accepting aid from ThunderClan. For the rest of that arc, he mellows out slightly, even coming to ThunderClan’s aid at the end of Twilight, but in The Power of Three, he’s back at it again, instigating problems with ThunderClan, attempting to take territory, and using the tunnels to WindClan’s advantage. Essentially, he become a big fat hypocrite, readily accepting ThunderClan’s help when it is direly needed, but turning around and judging the other Clans for doing the same.

- - - - -

So, out of the eight leaders that are touched upon in the series, only a couple of them are actually halfway decent. Each one has their own crowning moments of awesome, but, for the most part, they remain, for lack of better word, complete jerks.

It just frustrates me, how ThunderClan has always been the Clan with the wise and noble leaders like Firestar and Bluestar, while the other Clans get the shaft with leaders who hold grudges and gang up on other Clans. While these things aren’t necessarily damning, so to speak, when you compare the other leaders to the leaders of ThunderClan, it makes them look completely selfish. Alas, it seems the ShadowClan is completely unredeemable, what with their four “bad” leaders in a row. Onewhisker does a complete 180 when he becomes leader, and Leopardstar was always a jerk. And then you have T-Clan, where the leaders can apparently do no wrong and are ever caught up in trying to help everyone and never even think to try to take territory from another Clan, even if it would benefit hungry warriors.

So, what do you guys think? Grossly unfair portrayal of other Clan leaders? Or are the leaders behaving as Clan leaders should, looking out for their own self-interest and the good of the Clan, and Firestar is at fault for being too soft?


note: I realize that Mistystar is now a leader, and I figure that she'd be an addition to the other "good" leaders, but I didn't make it that far into the series, so I can't comment on her actions as a leader.

[vbfdoee]

You make a lot of really good points. I really hadn't even thought about how even sort-of sympathetic characters wound up being jerks as leaders.

My best guess on the justification for this is that ThunderClan have to be the 100% unambiguous Good Guys™ all of the time. The obvious course of action is to make every leader of every clan except ThunderClan a complete jerk, even if they have no reason to be so based on their previous characterization. These books fall into this sort of trap a lot, I think.

[Grey]

note: I realize that Mistystar is now a leader, and I figure that she'd be an addition to the other "good" leaders, but I didn't make it that far into the series, so I can't comment on her actions as a leader.

Don't forget, though, she's half Thunderclan and looks like Bluestar. I'm thinking the resemblance and genetics are playing a part there.

[Lady Ten]

Sept 7, 2012 17:36:56 GMT -6 CATION said:

He started out decently enough, thanking Firepaw & Co. for their help with Brokenstar. But then he becomes leader and bam! Insta-jerk. He has the gall to disagree with Bluestar’s infinite wisdom in bringing WindClan back to the forest, argues with Crookedstar over the river, unites with RiverClan to drive WindClan back out of the territories, and then attacks ThunderClan (with the aid of WindClan, I guess old hostilities die fast) when it is discovered that they are sheltering Brokenstar/tail.

Can you give us some quotes/more explanation for all this? I must've read about all this happening at some point, but my memory is fuzzy on this guy. Why does he disagree about bringing WindClan back? Why does he fight with Crookedstar?

And I have completely forgotten about the sheltering of Brokenstar. Why did ThunderClan even do that?

Tigerstar: I could go into a recap of all the stuff that went down with this enemy-who-took-fifty-books-to-die, but I think we’re familiar.

Speaking of which, is there a way to make a thread analyzing how unsatisfying that death scene was, and why? I'd write it myself but (a) no books with me right now and (b) I'd get sidetracked complaining about how Scourge was able to take all Tigerstar's lives at once, and yet somehow the same didn't happen with Firestar.

The same Clan that was ready to kick some serious butt when they found out that Brokenstar was with ThunderClan is now accepting one of Brokenstar’s chief co-conspirators, not to mention a handful of his other allies? Yeah, yeah, makes perfect sense.

Wait, that happened too? I'm confused, Erins.

and when Sol comes along, he declares the ShadowClan will not follow StarClan any longer. And, of course, he does his usually sneering about how foolish and weak ThunderClan cats are.

That part actually doesn't sound half bad.

During the journey to the lake, she remains snarky as ever, and even causes tensions once the new territories are established when she demands more territory. She is even convinced by Hawkfrost to exile Stormfur and Brook – not exactly an exemplary Clan leader.

What's wrong with being snarky and exiling Brook? I didn't read that far, but sounds like Brook didn't even take a warrior name, so it's not like she'd joined the Clan.

So, out of the eight leaders that are touched upon in the series, only a couple of them are actually halfway decent. Each one has their own crowning moments of awesome, but, for the most part, they remain, for lack of better word, complete jerks.

It just frustrates me, how ThunderClan has always been the Clan with the wise and noble leaders like Firestar and Bluestar, while the other Clans get the shaft with leaders who hold grudges and gang up on other Clans.

I'd never noticed all this, not as a conglomerate pattern, but looks like you have a point here.

Though I must take issue with describing Firestar and Bluestar as wise and noble, ahaha.

and Firestar is at fault for being too soft?

Well, that might be its own topic of discussion.

[Grey]

Alas, it seems the ShadowClan is completely unredeemable, what with their four “bad” leaders in a row.

This is what I like to call ‘the Slytherin Syndrome’. I am going to assume you are all reasonably familiar with Harry Potter (this will be somewhat necessary, as I tend to use that series as my favourite exemplum for various things).

In Harry Potter, the Slytherins are painted in a thoroughly negative light, almost invariably. Harry is warned against them (note: by past and future Gryffindor-aligned people, such as Hagrid and Ron Weasley), and they are described as:

”Perhaps it was Harry’s imagination, after all he’d heard about Slytherin, but he thought they looked an unpleasant lot.”

Slytherin students are often ugly, such as Marcus Flint who looked as though he had troll heritage and Pansy Parkinson who apparently has a face similar to a snub-snouted dog. They are also impudent, cowardly, haughty, violent and nasty to others. They are the “bad guys”, even from the beginning.

“There’s not a single witch or wizard who went bad who wasn’t in Slytherin.”

This is incredibly debatable, but you see the implication. Slytherin is the bad place and bad people; they are set to be the enemies.

This is called ‘otherizing’.

You’re probably wondering what this has to do with Warriors. I apologise for taking so long getting the point, as usual.

Shadowclan is the Warriors’ Slytherin. They are purposefully made out to be “bad”, predominantly for the sake of developing plots. They are not supposed to be sympathetic because it’s difficult to dislike or hate something you can understand, reason with or sympathise with – so Shadowclan must be seen as deserving of it, mainly through “bad” leadership.

While this is not exactly condonable from an ethical standpoint, it’s a fairly popular technique in much literature.

There’s another reason I have Harry Potter as my example. It’s not only to exemplify the ‘otherizing’ of Slytherin and Shadowclan, but also to highlight the inherent prejudice of the situation.

Because, you see, Harry only ever hears these negative things about Slytherins mainly from other Gryffindors. And everyone knows about the age-old rivalry there. Is it clever, as a reader, to trust a source so blindly biased? I think not.

In the first arc of Warriors, Fireheart (as I shall refer to him in this) is a Thunderclan cat, and Thunderclan and Shadowclan also do not get on particularly well (this is natural for the clans, of course). This is not as pronounced as the Gryffindor-Slytherin rivalry, but the rivalry is not the focus here.

It is simply the fact the story is based in Thunderclan and that the protagonist is aligned with them.

In Harry Potter, no Slytherins are allowed to have a perspective. They do not get involved in Dumbledore’s Army. Of course, that is because no Slytherins were invited to the secret meetings. The Slytherins were kicked out of the Great Hall at the end because one (particularly silly) girl said something dumb.

Slytherin is not given a chance to defend themselves in the eyes of the reader, because that is not the author’s intention. In many ways, I view J.K. Rowling as an exemplary author – but she still writes Slytherin House as though they were a nest of devils in a hotbox. This bothered me, until I realized one thing.

These moments are narrated in third-person limited style. Whatever is written, it’s through the Harry-the-Gryffindor viewing glass. That means, regardless of what a Slytherin does, the narration will write the Slytherin person in the way that Harry sees them, not in the omniscient impartial way that happens in some other books.

I think I am quite safe in saying that is the same in Warriors. The cats are written (albeit with far less skill) through Fireheart’s third person eyes. Even if an enemy leader did something we would view as reasonable under the circumstances, Fireheart’s viewing glass is going to skew that.

This is not to say it’s right or good. I am still disappointed that Slytherins are given such a bad reputation. But that in itself is evidence of the power of bias, as I am undoubtedly Slytherin-aligned myself.

I do think that this is partially why Shadowclan appear so bad, compared to most others. Not because they are, but rather because Fireheart (and his fellows) believe them to be.

[Lady Ten]

Sept 9, 2012 7:53:12 GMT -6 Grey said:

Shadowclan is the Warriors’ Slytherin. They are purposefully made out to be “bad”, predominantly for the sake of developing plots. They are not supposed to be sympathetic because it’s difficult to dislike or hate something you can understand, reason with or sympathise with

Wrong. There are plenty of people/characters whom I understand (or assume I understand) yet still dislike. It's not just possible, it's easy. Further, the understandable, reasonable, sympathetic characters can sometimes make for the absolute scariest villains. Those are the kind that really creep me out -- not the distant, lofty "maniacs" beyond comprehension. But that could be an essay all its own.

However, your point about ShadowClan -- that they are constantly demonized and otherized -- still stands. Also, given the parallels between the four clans and the four houses, a thread comparing the two series could be interesting.

Slytherin is not given a chance to defend themselves in the eyes of the reader, because that is not the author’s intention. In many ways, I view J.K. Rowling as an exemplary author – but she still writes Slytherin House as though they were a nest of devils in a hotbox.

Off-topic inquiry: "nest of devils in a hotbox"?

These moments are narrated in third-person limited style. Whatever is written, it’s through the Harry-the-Gryffindor viewing glass. That means, regardless of what a Slytherin does, the narration will write the Slytherin person in the way that Harry sees them, not in the omniscient impartial way that happens in some other books.

I think I am quite safe in saying that is the same in Warriors. The cats are written (albeit with far less skill) through Fireheart’s third person eyes. Even if an enemy leader did something we would view as reasonable under the circumstances, Fireheart’s viewing glass is going to skew that.

This is not to say it’s right or good. I am still disappointed that Slytherins are given such a bad reputation. But that in itself is evidence of the power of bias, as I am undoubtedly Slytherin-aligned myself.

I do think that this is partially why Shadowclan appear so bad, compared to most others. Not because they are, but rather because Fireheart (and his fellows) believe them to be.

Indeed. That the POV is third-person limited is an important aspect to remember when analyzing any part of the series. Regardless, Cation's argument remains intact that other clan leaders are characterized as thoroughly buttheaded, but to determine just how bad these leaders "really" are, we'll have to determine how reliable the narration is on any given point. Any thoughts on that? Are there any parts of what Cation has listed that were probably just in Firestar's head?

[Grey]

Wrong. There are plenty of people/characters whom I understand (or assume I understand) yet still dislike. It's not just possible, it's easy. Further, the understandable, reasonable, sympathetic characters can sometimes make for the absolute scariest villains. Those are the kind that really creep me out -- not the distant, lofty "maniacs" beyond comprehension. But that could be an essay all its own.

Are we speaking of children or you, Ten? Because I am speaking of children, as they are the intended audience of these books - particularly Warriors. Children are not especially adept at understanding or debating moral ambiguity. If someone steals a loaf of bread, the child will likely say they're guilty and bad for stealing. You tell them that person stole the bread to feed their family, and that kid is probably going to have a bit of a breakdown about that conundrum. Not to say older people won't as well, but it seems to be more difficult and perplexing for children.

Thus, authors of children's books tend to make their villains and antagonists unsympathetic to limit the ambiguity for their audience. There is usually a clear line between good and bad, and I think this came up somewhere else around here? In any case, I was generalising, but don't forget you aren't exactly the most ordinary of people either.

Off-topic inquiry: "nest of devils in a hotbox"?

Yes. Troublesome and fairly anarchic in comparison to everyone else.